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Posted on 07/02/25 08:55:42 AM |
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Steve Caplin
Administrator Posts: 6977 Reply  |
Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
This week's Challenge comes from GKB, who was intrigued by this old water pump in the Norfolk town of Walsingham. Gordon suggests that you might like to get it working again – but then sensibly points out that you might well have other ideas. High res is here.  |
Posted on 07/02/25 10:08:00 AM |
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Mariner
Renaissance Mariner Posts: 2971 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Gordon, is that a chimney on top, or some sort of heavenly drain pipe? Only kidding. |
Posted on 07/02/25 10:16:54 AM |
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Mariner
Renaissance Mariner Posts: 2971 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
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Posted on 07/02/25 1:54:02 PM |
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lwc
Hole in One Posts: 3069 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Aquaman always spends his holidays in Walsingham... 
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Posted on 08/02/25 07:17:01 AM |
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Ben Boardman
Printing Pro Posts: 580 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
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Posted on 08/02/25 12:04:51 PM |
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Mariner
Renaissance Mariner Posts: 2971 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Very impressive Ben. So that's how the water is collected: through the window at the back. But of course! I suggest the door be left open though - it's sure to be warm work pumping all that waterl. I searched hard for the photograph you used, but without success. Well done! |
Posted on 09/02/25 1:00:04 PM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Is it possible that it is even more impressive than you thought and that the photograph used is in fact Ben's own creation? This is impeccably done Ben! The only tiny giveaway is the perspective on the wagon. Otherwise (outside the Photoshop context of this challenge) I would have accepted this, without hesitation, as a genuine old photograph. _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
Posted on 09/02/25 1:16:06 PM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
According to Walsingham's website, Walsingham was a huge centre of pilgrimage since the Middle Ages — one of the four great shrines of medieval Christendom, ranking alongside Jerusalem, Rome and Santiago da Compostella. Then came the Reformation in 1538. Walsingham’s principal trade came to an abrupt end. According to the same authority, the brazier was not fitted until after 1900. But as our mentor said last week "Should we do what is actually right, or what looks right? I strongly tend towards the latter, as you know." Well thank you Mr. Caplin ........ in this case, that's very handy! However, truth to tell, I don't find this very satisfying. It looks like a shot from a cheap movie! I am not sure why. I fiddled with it endlessly and, whatever I tried, I seemed to sink deeper into the mud. So, in the end, I simply stopped and posted. Curious to know what others think. Is it, maybe, nothing to do with Photoshop and simply the completely empty town that looks so wrong?  _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
Posted on 09/02/25 2:24:19 PM |
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Ant Snell
Specular Specialist Posts: 552 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
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Posted on 09/02/25 7:36:39 PM |
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Frank
Eager Beaver Posts: 1722 Reply  |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Fun one Ant Ben - looks like we both found same BG image  |
Posted on 09/02/25 7:52:11 PM |
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Frank
Eager Beaver Posts: 1722 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
David -maybe a crop would help - I like it better with less foreground - other than that looks good.  |
Posted on 10/02/25 09:16:58 AM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Yes, Frank, you could be right. My image was all about shadow play so I left lots of empty space to make the shadows really 'pop'. However, in purely composition terms the crop is better. It prioritises the procession more. I love your daguerrotype effect. Particularly the uneven saturation and density. Interesting that you found the same background as Ben. I was really thinking that Ben had maybe created his by clever aging and distressing. _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
Posted on 10/02/25 3:11:01 PM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
David MacBruegel ......... ........ somehow looks much better if you have Carmina Burana playing in the background!! 
Well this much better but still not quite right. A lot of fun (and work and challenge) to do. I think the problem is that any literal photographic treatment of a mediaeval scene has, by definition, to be fake! To create the crowds I had to break with my principle's and draw on AI images ..... something I never do. The difficulty is that most of the real photos in mediaeval dress come either from costume catalogues or are taken at mediaeval role play festivals. In both cases they tend be very posed looking straight at camera, and back views are almost non existent. One reason my image is much smaller than I usually post is the appalling quality of the online AI I had to use. The images look fine at first glimpse but the moment you zoom in you find squashed deformed faces with missing features and even extra limbs sticking out of odd places. We all know that AI has a long way to go with human figures but I didn't expect major online libraries to be stocked with images that we would instantly reject out of hand in an AI generation session. The example below is not cherry picked, it's pretty typical. I was really shocked. I had no idea!  _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
Posted on 10/02/25 4:46:37 PM |
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lwc
Hole in One Posts: 3069 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Nice work everyone! An interesting subject. |
Posted on 10/02/25 4:51:33 PM |
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lwc
Hole in One Posts: 3069 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
As has been noted in a few previous challenges, I have a fondness for old distressed photos. Following Ben’s lead, I offer my version of the pump house in daguerreotype… c.1840 
Not animated. |
Posted on 10/02/25 9:05:44 PM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
OK, photo nerd time. We have had three vintage entries. All great and all different. First off Ben's early photographic print. Although it goes fairly smoothly from one density to the next it still has a distinct 'step' from one tone to the next which is typical of the orthographic negative of that period. The very slight grain is consistent with the glass plates of that period, although the large format of these tended to be less grainy that the smaller format of the plastic negatives that were to follow. Frank's offering is an effect. Maybe not totally authentic but quite beautiful with it's varying densities and saturations. I really love this! It's very delicate. Loyd's come up with the real McCoy! He's captured the limited density range of the daguerreotype perfectly. It's not just low contrast, it's quite different. It's clipping with total loss of information at black and white points which are well above and below peak levels. The vignetting is of course typical of the lenses of the period. My only issue is with the scratching. We all love to do it 'cos it's so tempting. Surprisingly many true daguerrotypes were well protected and have survived well because of their fragility. My apologies to Steve and everyone for putting on the "expert's" hat. It's certainly not my role here. However, in my young days, alongside cinema projection, I was for nine months a professional black and white dark room printer. Assessing and printing their negatives for choosy professional photographers taught me more about exposure and densitometry than anything else and monochrome imagery is a subject that has remained one of deep interest ever since. _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
Posted on 10/02/25 10:09:24 PM |
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lwc
Hole in One Posts: 3069 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
David - Yes, I did get carried away with the scratches, but for me that is part of the attraction of old images. Here is another, this time as an albumen print. I tried to be more reserved with regards to scratches on this one and added a bit of organic defects (mold, water, etc.). The time frame is moved to c.1860. 
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Posted on 11/02/25 05:59:22 AM |
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Mariner
Renaissance Mariner Posts: 2971 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Excellent work producing crowds of 16th century people David. I don't use AI because it takes a lot of the creative fun out of the work. I suppose I am just being old fashioned. I found the photo Ben used. Well cleaned up Ben! They didn't have cameras in Tudor times, so the women aren't properly dressed. Here it is.  |
Posted on 11/02/25 06:05:30 AM |
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Mariner
Renaissance Mariner Posts: 2971 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
You can see there is a spike on top of the brazier. |
Posted on 11/02/25 09:16:36 AM |
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DavidMac
Director of Photoshop Posts: 5471 Reply |
Re: Challenge 1040: Water in Walsingham
Nor do I Michael!! ...... for the exactly the same reason! This is the very first time I have ever used it. I quite simply couldn't find a sufficient quantity of usable photographs in mediaeval costume any other way. I was faced with a choice of using some AI for some of the crowd or abandoning the image altogether. I probably could have put them together one by one from bits and pieces of real photos and puppet warping them out of their poses. But, with the quantity I needed, I would still be doing my entry come summer! _________________ The subtlety and conviction of any Photoshop effect is invariably inversely proportional to the number of knobs on it ....... |
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