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Posted on 15/01/05 10:06:11 PM |
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mj
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Here you are Maiden. Challege accepted.  _________________ -Never met a PS'er I didn't like- Will Rogers |
Posted on 16/01/05 01:34:23 AM |
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Atomicfog
Virtual Visualizer Posts: 238 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
I was young. _________________ -Atomic |
Posted on 16/01/05 07:28:14 AM |
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maiden
Golden Gif Gagster Posts: 471 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
I don't think I was laying down a challenge, only that my pic was a entry for the Friday Challenge, but nice postcard all the same 
Atomic Fog The second of my images is not an entry to the challenge I posted it to show you in better detail for the first image. Just one point, and please don't anybody take this the wrong way, I'm all in favour of giving feedback and criticism but rather than having a running commentary would it not be an idea if people waited until all the entries were in before submitting their crits, perhaps after Steve had submitted his or the night before. Just a suggestion. _________________ mad as a badger and twice as furry |
Posted on 16/01/05 07:36:14 AM |
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Atomicfog
Virtual Visualizer Posts: 238 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Sorry Maiden, but like I said before...
Unless you can give me a good reason why I shouldn't do this... 
_________________ -Atomic |
Posted on 16/01/05 10:55:42 AM |
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maiden
Golden Gif Gagster Posts: 471 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Well one good reason is that your making more work for yourself, by having to reply in sections. Plus you cannot get an overall feel of the challenge until you've seen all entries so it would be better to wait until the end. And also because your rating out of ten you may over/under rate at the begining of the challenge. I also feel that realism is not always the key issue in doing montages. Let's say for instance a cilent has a photograph of marina that is empty and wants you to place a yacht sailing across the marina, in that case your goal would be photorealism; in terms of matching the colour, contrast, saturation, lighting, specularity, shadows, reflection as well as ensuring that the water breaks around the yacht as it would if it was actually in-situ. However, in the example of a Hound holding a postcard of a fox riding a waterski there is no realism involved and is a matter of "suspending your disbelief". So you add shadow, match lighting, colour, contrast, reflection and specularity as best you can, even though you know the image will never look "real" as Hounds don't have opposible thumbs in which to grip a postcard, a fox doesn't have a wide enough hip bone to straddle a jetski, nor does it have opposible thumbs in order to grip the throttle - but it's all about suspension of disbelief. Like Tweaknik's brilliant entry, you aren't going to get someone saying "Wow look at that fox riding a bike, that's a very clever fox!" unless they had no idea at all about photomontaging, otherwise they would say "That's a very clever bit of montaging" as it is, and it is that we should be looking at rather than if it's realistic enough to pass as being real. Another example is with cartoons, cartoons use all sorts of trickery to help you suspend your disbelief - take Scooby Doo for instance when Shaggy & Scooby run they do so in a comic book fashion of windmilling legs and arms but it graphically demonstrates the illusion of running and is very funny to watch. Steve's book has a section about Hyper-Realism in which concepts are relayed in exaggerated terms in order to illustrate the point - Photorealism isn't the key issue with such images. So let's not get too bogged down with photo-realism as sometimes you have to look beyond that and see the overall image and the humour involved. I hope that my image came across as funny, and that I illustrated the point of that humour well, rather than does the image look photo-perfect, if I was aiming for that I would have spent a whole lot more time on the image and then I would have been missing the point. These are just my opinions, I hope that nobody takes offence to those opinions, because I respect your right to hold views and of course disagree with me. Becky _________________ mad as a badger and twice as furry |
Posted on 16/01/05 11:19:26 AM |
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Atomicfog
Virtual Visualizer Posts: 238 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
True, but I don't mind.
I know what the task at hand is.
If they fix their picture I can edit my post.
I agree, that is why I rate in many different aspects. _________________ -Atomic |
Posted on 16/01/05 12:23:52 PM |
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maiden
Golden Gif Gagster Posts: 471 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Fair enough, but I do think it breaks up the challenge to have crits and ratings inserted inbetween challenge entries, when they would be better placed at the end of the challenge. No disrespect to you but I'm more interested in what Steve has to say, after all he's the expert and it wouldn't be Steve's Friday Challenge without him. 
Perhaps we should have a Topic called "Member's Critique" where we can critique each other's work/ challenge entries but I fear having them here will put off new members and vistors from having a go themselves as they may feel it's all a little too critical and may fear they're not up to the grade. This is a challenge not a competition, after all - there is no winners and losers, no "my picture is better than yours" but a showcase of our individual skills. We all have differing styles and techniques and I for one, no disrespect to Steve intended, wouldn't want to be a Steve Caplin clone. I have my own style, my own humour, and some of my own techniques which I cherish and sometimes perhaps feel a little hurt if people say they aren't correct, because they are correct to me. I expect other people here feel the same way, that's not to say I can't stand criticism though, but let's not be too pernickerty about "realism". I like everybody's work here, as everybody puts an effort in and that means more to me than image-perfection. But once again that's just my opinion. Becky _________________ mad as a badger and twice as furry |
Posted on 16/01/05 12:38:06 PM |
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Glen
Montage Maestro Posts: 282 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
OK OK , it HAD to happen....... fight night 3 !! Atomic, a few things for you to think/act upon. you're critisisms have been noted, you've had your say and as to a good reason why you could wait until the end to give them - YOU ARE TAKING UP TOO MUCH SPACE IN THIS CHALLENGE WITH YOUR DRIVEL. (read that again) Steve suggested in the last challenge that we wait until the end to post our comments - a very good idea as it does allow the flow of the images. You however, seem to think that we shall 'improve' on our work from your comments. Well try looking in your own backyard first - your image has been altered from the first entry (though in your own words you assess your work as you make it before posting it here with satisfaction) and yet still you have not sorted out the colouring of the foxes gun, the depth of the foxes shadow, the clarity of the fox in the tree, the strange contrast of the man and the legibility of your attempt at a humourous strap line. Let people put their images up, let others enjoy those images, get the weekly feedback and then add your ratings (which by the way I find overall negative in tone). You really DO have to learn how to give feedback you know, but I guess that'll come with maturity. I look forward to the rest of the challenge images. Atomic, until Friday, go play in the yard and stop pissing me off.
_________________ minds are like parachutes - they only work when they are open |
Posted on 16/01/05 1:01:11 PM |
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tweaknik
Pixel Perfector Posts: 49 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Atomicfog: I’m sure (well, I hope) your intentions are good, but I really don’t think people are looking to be judged or rated by you. By all means, if you have something constructive to say about a picture, go for it, but it’s likely that this rating system you’ve decided to use will start to really annoy people. As maiden said, this is a challenge, not a competition. If anything, the challenge should be with yourself, you should strive to create a picture better than your last. EDIT: Glen, well said. |
Posted on 16/01/05 1:47:24 PM |
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mj
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Sorry Maiden, I misread your post, and thanks. _________________ -Never met a PS'er I didn't like- Will Rogers |
Posted on 16/01/05 3:19:06 PM |
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maiden
Golden Gif Gagster Posts: 471 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Yes Glen & Tweaknik, your points echo what I was expressing, although, Glen I don't see this as a fight - Atomic has a right to express his views but I feel, as do others, that those views are better left until the end of the Challenge. Let's not lose a good thing here, Steve's website is one of the best around and full of talented people ready to share their knowledge and I fully approve of this, not that it needs my consent
Steve is a generous person of kind nature, I know this because if he wasn't he would tell us all to figure it out by ourselves. I believe I'm right in thinking that his objective here is to support the material in his books and extend that to further us as montagers, and that includes people who are new to Photoshop and montaging. Such a highly critical/competitive environment on this website will only lead to putting people off and detract from helping people. So let's rule a line under this discussion and get back to the fun stuff of montaging, whether it's hyper-realism/cartoony style or Photo-perfection you're after they are all valid techniques and all opinion is subjective anyway, there is no objective truth about photo-montaging only good, bad and indifferent images. Have fun - Maiden orders you to
Becky PS MJ, I'm glad I've inspired you, it's been a bit of a mini-challenge _________________ mad as a badger and twice as furry |
Posted on 16/01/05 9:25:34 PM |
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Steve Caplin
Administrator Posts: 6934 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
So this is what happens when I go away for the weekend! Bar fight! Atomicfog, I have no problem with you offering crits, but I think your rating system is unnecessarily harsh and is bound to offend. Giving ratings at all is somewhat dubious, but giving a rating of '0' or '1' for work and humour can only upset people. Becky, Glen, Tabitha, Tweaknik, MJ, I'm sorry if you've been offended by some lack of tact here. Your replies have all been sensible, moderate and well expressed. Thank you for your patience. On with the challenge! |
Posted on 16/01/05 9:33:30 PM |
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Atomicfog
Virtual Visualizer Posts: 238 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
I didn't realize that most of felt this way. I figured that if you didn't like my critisism you would just skip passed it, but I was wrong. I just meant for the numbers to be my opinion, not a global opinion or anything. It is pretty hard to figure out how people here will react to things. I figured if I started talking more fights might erupt, so I will go ahead and shut up. Sorry for disrupting the topic (Although I wish people would have PMed me about it). Sorry to anyone I offended with my critisism. I promise I only thought that I was helping. P.S I read my posts, I did't mean to sound like I was better than anyone else. _________________ -Atomic |
Posted on 16/01/05 10:20:31 PM |
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trinityofone
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Ooops, I missed most of this! _________________ A happy-go-lucky chap, always dressed in black |
Posted on 17/01/05 01:32:02 AM |
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Jeff Scranton
* Posts: 43 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Here's that wacky parallel universe again, with Rick Fox still playing for the L.A. Lakers as an actual fox! A really, really, really large fox, shown here attempting a jumper at the buzzer from mid court. Rick wears a specially designed Laker kilt to accommodate his tail. The little fox is one of the officials.  |
Posted on 17/01/05 01:39:41 AM |
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trinityofone
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Sometimes it's not wise to be in my head.....  _________________ It must be Thursday, I never could get the hang of Thursdays |
Posted on 17/01/05 01:46:29 AM |
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Glen
Montage Maestro Posts: 282 Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
David, N-ice one _________________ minds are like parachutes - they only work when they are open |
Posted on 17/01/05 09:49:27 AM |
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tabitha 1
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
That brings back all sorts of memories of Foxes Glacier Mint adverts David... ... and Glen, that is wayyyy toooo lame!! _________________ "There are only two things a child will share willingly; communicable diseases and its mother's age." Benjamin Spock. |
Posted on 17/01/05 11:04:45 AM |
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Pooch
** Posts: 110 Reply  |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
I am back, complete with MS Paint   _________________ Those are my principles. If you don't like them I have others. Groucho Marx (1890-1977) |
Posted on 17/01/05 12:52:54 PM |
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tabitha 1
Guest Reply |
Re: Contest 28: Fox hunting
Nice one Chris, must have taken you ages to get the heads to fit on the bodies just right!!
Glad to have you back again buddy _________________ "She had lost the art of conversation but not, unfortunately, the power of speech." George Barnard Shaw. |
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